Pete Buttigieg's exit interview

Pence to the inauguration? Plus: Another voice outside I-465

In the heat of the 2020 Democratic primary, Joe Biden attacked Pete Buttigieg in a now-deleted, scathing digital ad called “Pete’s Record” — mocking him for doing little more than installing “decorative lights under bridges” as mayor of “small town” South Bend.

Nearly five years and several political lifetimes later, that ad is water under one of the 12,300 bridges under construction or repair as part of Biden’s $1.2 trillion infrastructure law. And it was Buttigieg, who Biden has since compared to his late son Beau, who oversaw the legislation’s implementation as Transportation secretary. Yet Biden has also recently expressed some frustration about the law, telling USA Today, “We would’ve been a hell of a lot better off had we been able to go much harder at getting some of these projects in the ground quicker.”

In an exit interview with me, conducted partly on the campus of Notre Dame in December and later over the phone this month, Buttigieg defended implementation of the infrastructure law, even as he acknowledged it didn’t deliver huge rewards in the 2024 election.

“I think what the president was getting at is an impatience we all feel about the recognition and credit that this work deserves,” he said. “But just the nature of the beast with this infrastructure work is that it takes longer than a political cycle to get it done.”

Buttigieg also spoke about the difficulty of governing when the truth seems up for grabs, Elon Musk’s role in the incoming Trump administration and chopping wood in his adopted hometown of Traverse City, where he’ll mull a future that could include either a Michigan gubernatorial bid in 2026 or a 2028 presidential campaign.

• ON WHETHER HE’LL ROOT FOR Michigan State or the University of Michigan—or stay with Notre Dame: “I love my new home, but I can’t ever forget where I came from. And by the way, I’m very excited about the Irish right now.”

• ON NOTRE DAME HEAD COACH MARCUS FREEMAN’S EXTENSION:

  “It’s crazy to think he’s younger than I am. And it’s a job where not unlike some jobs in public life, he gets withering criticism for anything that doesn’t go perfectly. But look at what he’s done with this program. It’s just incredible. I went back for that first playoff game and hadn’t been to Notre Dame stadium in a while. The energy was just amazing.”

Good Sunday afternoon, and welcome back to IMPORTANTVILLE. It’s inauguration weekend, and many Hoosiers have decamped to Washington D.C. to celebrate the soon to be 47th president, Donald J. Trump. Sen. Jim Banks posted to Instagram photos of him with Snoop Dogg.

Former Vice President Mike Pence is weighing attending Trump’s inauguration, The New York Times reports.

AROUND IMPORTANTVILLE

• YOUNG LOVE: We scooped earlier this week that Sen. Todd Young will back Pete Hegseth for Defense secretary. That’s a good early sign for Trump’s nominees.

• INHERENT VICE: Jason Critchlow, the Portage Township Trustee, is hearing from former party officials, county party chairs, some donors, and some of the campaign folks throughout the state that he should be the party’s vice chair.

• THREE MOLLY PROBLEM: I mixed up my Mollies in an item last week. Molly Deuberry Craft is deputy chief of staff for communications for Gov. Mike Braun.

  Molly Swigart is communications director for the Indiana Senate GOP. Molly Gillaspie is communications director for the Indiana House GOP. I regret the error, and have brought shame upon my kin.

• ILLINOISE: A proposal from House Speaker Todd Huston would admit dozens of Illinois counties into Indiana. The Indiana Democratic Party said in a statement: “Instead of passing universal pre-K or ending waiting lists for healthcare, Indiana Republicans want to meddle in the internal affairs of our neighbors. This legislative session should be about Hoosiers — not political games,” said Indiana Democratic Party Chair Mike Schmuhl. “Making this a top priority over pre-K support and tackling rising health insurance costs shows this Republican supermajority does not care about putting the needs of Hoosiers first. Any boundary changes to our states would require the approval of both state legislatures and of the United States Congress, and this commission proposal is just a distraction from the handouts to the wealthy and the cutting of healthcare coverage for working Hoosier families that Republicans plan to pass this session.”

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OUTSIDE I-465

Tallian | Courtesy of Tallian campaign

A recurring feature in which we talk with voices outstate to get a fuller picture of Indiana.

Former State Sen. Karen Tallian (D-Ogden Dunes) became the first candidate to announce a run for Indiana Democratic Party chair this year who has ever held elected office as a Democrat.

In an interview, we talk about why Kamala Harris lost, why she broke with former attorney general candidate Destiny Wells, and more.

Questions and answers have been lightly edited for length and clarity.

Why do you want to be chair of the Indiana Democratic Party?

Because I think I can do the best. And I’ve spent years of my life in this party, and it’s in trouble. And I could stay retired, or I could come back and get back to work.

You’re from Ogden Dunes, but you live in the Virgin Islands half the year. Is that right?

No. It’s not right. I’ve had [the place] for 11 years. I spend a couple months a year there.

Would you still spend a couple months there if you were elected Democratic Party chair?

Not likely.

Why did Kamala Harris lose?

Well, come on, you've got 85 pundits all over the country trying to analyze that.

Yes, but as the potential future leader of the Indiana Democratic Party, why do you think she lost?

Well, God, that’s a question that requires, like, the next half hour.

Yes, but part of the job of the state chair is to communicate crisply. Pretend we’re having this conversation riding up in an elevator in the PNC Building to party headquarters and you’ve only got 30 seconds to explain it to me.

Well, I think there are a number of reasons. I think voter turnout being the biggest one. When you have 30 percent voter turnout, or 35 percent voter turnout in Evansville and Marion County, and a lot of the Democrats struggled, you can’t win races.

How will you turn things around?

Well, I have some plans. I have some plans for structural reorganization within the party.

Do you have the blessing of the labor caucus?

David Fry from the laborers endorsed me. I have spoken to the steel workers up here. I’ve spoken to IBEW. I’ve spoken to AFL. I know all these people from the right-to-work days.

I mean the the labor votes on the state central committee.

Yeah, I’ve talked to all of them.

You have the backing of all of them?

Uh, let me say this. I’ve talked to all of them. I am not going to speak for them—to that yet—and say I have an endorsement from all of them.

Should State Sen. Greg Taylor, who has been accused of sexual harassment, step down from the state Senate?

That is not the call of the Indiana State Democratic Party. He was elected by people.

I'm not going to make that call because I think that whatever I said would look like either I'm supporting something that I shouldn’t, or that I've a vendetta. I don't think it was very fair to get into that. The fight belongs to the State Senate caucus.

Do you think, generally speaking, that a state senator who has sexually harassed colleagues should hold office in the state of Indiana?

Well, generally, no, I don't think that.

So how would you handle the code of conduct adopted by the party as it relates to this particular senator, Greg Taylor?

That's not fair, Adam. The code of conduct that the Senate…the code of conduct that was set up was for state party and as an organization, it was not meant to dictate anything to the to the state.

In this particular role as the state party chair, you’d be tasked with raising a significant amount of money each cycle. What’s the most money you've ever raised for a political campaign?

I’m not sure that that's a fair question, either. Because I would raise money for myself and other candidates. The most amount of money I raised personally was when I as running for attorney general.

And how much was that?

You could read the campaign report. My memory is between $100,000 and $150,000.

And that's the most money you’ve ever raised?

You are not listening to me. I didn’t say that. I said that I raised a lot of money for our Senate caucus.

You didn’t track how much you raised? I mean, most politicians track how much they raised for their colleagues.

Well, maybe I'm not most politicians. [Publisher’s note: An aide later told IMPORTANTVILLE that Tallian raised roughly $4 million as Senate Democrat Caucus chair from 2016-2020, and for her short statewide runs. ]

Who should be the next Democratic Party chair at the national level?

Oh, that's getting real interesting. I think that the most vital candidate, not necessarily in order, are Gov. Martin O'Malley, Ken Martin from Minnesota and Ben Wikler from Wisconsin.

Speaking of the DNC, do you have the backing of your fellow DNC member from Indiana, Patricia Yount?

I think you should ask Patty that question.

You endorsed your chair challenger Destiny Wells over Beth White in her attorney general battle last year. Why do you think she was a fit for that position, but not this one?

Well, the easiest answer to that is that those two jobs have two different scopes.

Why do you think you're a better candidate than Jennifer McCormick?

I'm not going to say anything bad about Jennifer. You know, I supported her run, but I don't think that she can bring back all the people to the table that I can.

Why do you think Democrats are failing to penetrate the donut counties in Hamilton County—and the suburbs writ large?

I don't know the answer to that, and I think that it’s part of the job of the next chair to figure that out and correct it.

It sounds like you're still searching for a lot of answers about where Democrats should go from here, both in Indiana and nationally.

I think we’re all searching for answers, but I know that one answer is this, and one answer has to be we need unity, not division.

We need to bring back people to the table, not cull people from the table. That’s my big disagreement with Destiny is that I see the way back as bringing more people back, not as getting rid of people.

What question should I ask you that I didn't already ask?

That is another standard question that every reporter asks me. Where’d you guys learn to ask that question? Every single reporter asks that question.

All right, I think we’ll end it there. Thanks so much and good luck.

Hey, hey, I hope I wasn't too feisty with you.